I apologize for the length of this post
Please allow me to clear some things up since several of my friends would identify with being Vita Nuda and I have been right beside Robbe in this mostly electronically speaking since it started.
There is no membership in Vita Nuda. They are just a network of folks 18-35 that plan events at mostly aanr clubs and resorts within their own regions. They get a group discount of some sort. The aanr rules concern advertisement and are just subject to the aanr brand. In the past to be part of Nude-U one had to be a full time student and an aanr member. From what I hear aanr will on occasion reimburse them for certain expenses When they front funds for events, but that must be approved and there is no telling when aanr will make good. Most of their focus has been on places not in Florida lately.
I am a member of (FYN)The Florida Young Naturists a 501-c non-profit org and Special Interest Group located within the Naturist Society. TNS does not fund FYN, they just donated a website for one year and Robbe did the rest. SFFB helped with the 501-c paperwork. We are a grassroots organization so our budget for planing events comes from our own memberships, small donations from clubs and private individuals as well as our own fundraisers like a bake sale on Haulover or a fresh squeezed Sun-aid stand at an event or festival. Sometimes TNS is kind enough to give us merch we can sell on the cheap at events and use the profits for our budget. It makes our logo totebags look less lonely at the booth at Bash.
The way our events work is if you have never been to the resort before there are no fees for the entire weekend/duration of the event. All new and interested folks need to worry about is transportation and food. Yearly membership is only $15 and membership in a national organization is not required nor does one need to be a Florida resident to join. The membership card entitles one to free camping and $6 day fees at events. At Sunsport Gardens, FYNs home base its just the same as paying student rates any time and At Paradise Valley in Georgia there is a smiler deal due to the Georgia spin off group
. The idea is in the future have more resorts that will take the FYN membership card for our discounted rate unless they already offer a better youth or young adult rate if not offer the student rate. The only requirement is being between the ages of 18-30 and there have been exceptions for people under 18 with consent from their parents or guardians and couples where one person is beyond the age range. Being outside the age range does not bar you from attending events just the fee discount. Two years and over one hundred members we are still growing and trying to structure while trying new things. Most of us started out strangers and now we are just good friends. FYN not interested in your sex,class,creed, or sexual orientation and not into overt public sexual displays and belligerent intoxication. TNS does no lord over FYN they just mentor and advise when its needed. We work closely with Vita Nuda here in Florida and their our friends. Some FYN members are aaner members just like some are TNS members, and some belong to both national entities.
My own posts can be found on YNAs facebook profile.
Many of us had our uncertainties about YNA coming out of no ware with a website, a blog plus a phone app on the way and the usual facebook page that excepted anyone and everyone. Speculation was if this was all about selling an app. From the site all one could deduce was that they were based in New York, but alluded no hint to their structure. I myself made a profile on their nudistnaturistamerica.org community tab but there was little activity except for a group with a link to NaturistZone part of Nudistfriends which made me raise and eyebrow.
Other than that there were no forum posts and little activity. Correspondence was sent out casually initially, but there seemed to be no reply. Robbe told me that he knew Felicity(pen name) in real life from the old aanr youth ambassador days and two FYN members travled to New York to attend the Nude Years Eve event, that is all we knew.
Come February at the Mid-Winter Naturist Festival at Sunsport, I attended to host some workshops and was apart of a few concerning Florida Young Naturists with other members including Robbe. A constant question asked from the average attendee to Naturist and Nudist leaders and club owners was Who &/or What is YNA, so on and so forth. all we could do was shrug and regurgitate what we already knew although we did hear some interesting hottub gossip that they had apparently bumped heads with the New England Travisuns for some reason. at Festival you meet people from all over the country and Canada and you would be surprised at the things you learn and hear aside from normal snowbird squawks.
Out of habit I checked facebook from my phone and saw that one of the Vita Nuda regions had posted that YNA was fishy and not who they appeared, which I found odd because I know one of the main founders and they were cool with YNA. Robbe had also expressed some concern because whoever was behind YNA spammed invites to all his facebook friends on the page used for FYN correspondence as well all as friends on his personal page. People that did not know he was a naturist including family members were getting invites and nude event information. Im sure he had to answer a few questions if you get my drift.
Once I returned home to my computer I noticed YNA had posted that they were being harassed by a Vita Nuda West member asking for names of their members. Soon several people started making small comments on their facebook page about the people they were befriending as well as questioning certain listed interests on the page such as voyeurism and group sex. For many the immediate issue was that those listed pages or interests did not seem characteristic of a profile used for perpetuating wholesome nude recreation. Generally it would be no interest of anyone's what a persons personal/sexual interests are listed on a personal profile but this one seems used by YNA for business or to put out information. Furthermore many of the people this profile friended on facebook were posting ads for sex and swinging blatantly on the page wall. Whoever is behind the YNA page said they didn't know what everyone was talking about and that if there was a problem to contact them privately.
None of the vita Nuda folks we know knew anything about it.
What set people off including Robbe was the strait forward wall post advertising Paradise lakes Resort, a very well known nudist turned swinger resort that hosts erotic parties. Many other people began calling the YNA page owner out for the quantity over quality strategy and the question was raised that maybe some of the profiles on their friends list as well as those making questionable wall posts were indeed real. The YNA page owner said in defense that their critics were being judgmental and discriminatory of peoples private sexual interests. At this point I think everyone had been checking regularly to see if the page had cleaned up assuming that the page owner was playing dumb for a reason.
I had tried to express to everyone I could that reporting the profile as a fake ,trying to ban it as was once done to FYNs page by a disgruntled former member or spamming the page could be perceived by them as harassment. That card was pulled.
The YNA page owner just posted a status claiming they were being harassed by Vita Nuda and that a persons interest in swinging should not disallow them from attending a nudist/naturist event. The old conversation about sexually oriented business and motives riding the coat tails of the movement was raised and even the real self proclaimed swingers got in on the back and forth (no pun intended). Robbe began commenting lists of visible page likes and interests of the obviously fake profiles that were posting on the YNA page wall. The YNA page owner just kept blasted robbe for being rude, prude, discriminatory and not helping the cause. Robbe responded that sexual interests are indeed private and not to be confused with naturism. Many other people commented that they would be uncomfortable knowing that attendees of an event may look at them as a voyeuristic sex object, let alone knowledge of that being a known interest of a founder or coordinator. The listing of visible interests and page likes continued with the YNA profile friends list.
One profile belonging to an alleged 14 year old girl (mind you they are random listed page links generated by what a user selects or likes on facebook) had several questionable interests. In particular this really seemed to get the YNA page owner fired up, berating Robbe for violating the privacy of a minor and how shameful it was to do so. By this time the YNA page owner managed to muster some support swinger and non swinger alike but most were new to the conversation.
Things were beginning to look like YNA was a lost cause.
I still felt that there were many unanswered questions and in the hope that some of the people behind the scenes were just overwhelmed and not voluntarily refraining from scrubbing their filters. I cobbled together an email asking about the YNA organizational structure and like I mentioned previously my concerns for the nudistnaturistamerica.org expressing that I felt there was a lack of admin and moderation of the site. This time I sent the email to the address on the facebook page.
{My corespondance with YNA}
Greetings, im Rick age 24. I apologize If I myself caused any offence on your facebook pages last night 3/2/11.
I am a member of FYN and on the board of directors of my home club Tallahassee Naturally, parent entity of the RSO Naturally@FSU. I agree correspondence could be done privately at better effect to perspective reputations. My concerns originally stemmed from my own lack of knowlege concerning just how YNA is set up. It seems everywhere I turn people ask what is YNA, and ask me if I'm in support, but I am not sure how to reply. I admit that I jumped on the comment bandwagon since it seemed that everything was out in the open. Previously I had encouraged my friends; or at least tried to, not blatantly flame or spam because harassment can go both ways and things can get personal. Powder keg. I write to you only on my own behalf
I have had a profile on
http://nudistnaturistamerica.org/ and know a few other people with profiles, however I was wondering if there was a present admin and if the site is being moderated. I had noticed several questionable ads and the only groups created so far are a "Nudist in Mexico" started my a male with a woman's picture and blank profile, the other is just a link to a singles dating site that is a facade of a chain of sites known for allowing solicitation of minors and predatory behavior. They have also taken photos of their profile members and reposted them on adult paysites. The site ring is also presumed under surveillance by law enforcement and FBI.
I have tried to use the contact link and email service offered by
http://nudistnaturistamerica.org/index.php/contact and had a copy sent to my email, however I have yet to see a reply back.
I was also curious as to the set up of the YNA organizational structure. Is there a president, treasury, or any governing entity? Is the group affiliated or sponsored by any other entity? Do you have any tax exemptions?
What is the process for buying tickets to YNA events and what is the selection/veting process used in determining who to invite or who may attend? Two FYN members went to New York to attended the New Years event and they said they had a great time.
What activities are there at events and/or what may be planned in the future.
Is there an active roll or contact list kept for members and what is the member application process on a local scale? ex. meeting, snailmail or e-mail/web correspondence.
Any policies and procedures?
does your governance have any direct contact.
I am not interested in names or contact information for individuals, we all need some degree of anonymity. I just want to be able to answer questions made to me by other folks.
Naturally & Humbly
Rick O.
_____________________________________
Hello Rick,
We welcome anyone to participate in the debate as long as they are respectful. Yes this whole thing wouldn't have been such a headache if people had just privately messaged us to say they have a problem with us.
Yes, there are administrators and we also trust our people to tell us of anything inappropriate as well. Jordan Blum and I (Felicity) are the two people who run YNA. We also have a webmaster/tech person. I guess some people may see "voyeurism" and "exhibitionism" listed in our interests of our profile and begin to doubt our credibility as a naturist group. However, whether people like it or not, there are many people who can be into both of these and also be naturists. It's just a matter of people being respectful of our policies. We don't tolerate anyone posting anything sexually inappropriate on our facebook wall or website.
Where have you seen "questionable ads"? And I've seen the dating website group of naturistzone.com. I looked at the website, and without making an account or trying to use it, nothing on it looks amiss. But if you know it to be a facade then we'll take your word for it and remove them. We did receive your email through the contact form, we've just been very busy with all the raucous!
As far as the setup of YNA goes, we set up a regular corporation. We're a small team, and we don't have that type of structure.
For our events, we have everyone register on our website if they would like to attend. Then we sell tickets through our website. We use registration to get everyone's basic information for screening/security purposes. We don't have any age limit or anything, we just try to have a decent male/female ratio at every event. For that reason, we can't always accept everyone who registers, as we get a bigger and bigger response each time.
So far we've had Nude Night Out and Nude Year's Eve. These were 2 parties that were basically like a regular party with drinks, music, dancing, body-painting, etc. Just that nobody's wearing any clothes. In the future when it warms up we plan to have meet-ups all over the area, at the beach and various clubs!
Our contact list is whoever is registered on our website as well as anyone we have in our contacts that isn't. We send out an email to all members around twice a month to notify them of events, etc. The only application process we use is registering as a member on our site. And the event registration is a type of process.
Policies/procedures: We have a few simple rules- be respectful of others, don't break any laws and dont try to push any "shady" or sexual agendas on anyone else. We don't tolerate any inappropriate sexual behavior at our events.
This email is the best way to reach us. People can write directly to me (Felicity) through this email or address Jordan, the other founder. But yes, we do choose to maintain some degree of anonymity.
Feel free to refer anyone to contact us directly if they have a list of questions. We'd be happy to answer them.
And yeah we remember those 2 from FYN, they were very nice! Happy they came.
Well I hope that answers all of your questions! Any more questions just email us back. :)
Best,
Felicity
___________________________________________________________
Hey
Actually since we can't see anything amiss ourselves with this dating group and website, would you be able to give us proof of their unlawful behavior?
Thanks,
Felicity
______________________________________________________________
The box I saw the ad in now says ad space available. Initially around the time the site appeared when I saw this ad it was of a naked woman legs spread with finger in her , the text was meet singles now.
NaturisZone is a front page kind of like a franchise and there are many more under the umbrella of NudistFriends, ones called NudistSexSeach another NaturistMatch and other combinations, they are all connected to a single network not there own separate sites. People set them up on there own servers and collect revenue from site traffic. Nudist friends is under the umbrella of SuccessfuMatch same network encompassing other sites of the same template. Although most of the archived forum postings from pedos and the like have been removed from whatever server hosted them and all the forums have been wiped clean and have started again. nothing else on the site is touched. Often to see certain forums one had to have a profile There was a whole thread on Wikipedia with sources of information. apparently the site has wiped its forum several times instead of allowing law enforcement any access, hence the surveillance. Once a profile is made there is no way to delete it or the pictures uploaded to it and even when asking a webmaster to delete it a month or so later you will get an e-mail that someone has looked or winked at your profile, generally a bot using another persons profile or a fake.. In the past many people were horrified to find their pictures from private galleries elsewhere on the internet. Even ones they sent in for certification that were not publicly posted.
This was a large issue in the days of skinbook a social network on ning that imploded due to many similar factors and poor insight and foresight on the part of admin and members. They made allot of waves but looked like hypocrites and it turned out most were. Ning restructured in a crusade against nudity and has since deleted skinbook but it did move to a new host only to be shut down by admin for bad PR regarding similar shadiness.
How well do you know your webmaster?
just curious
~Rick
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During the weekend YNAs website, associated blogs and facebook pages explode with links to a facebook event posting titled "Will Vita Nuda apologize for their offensive behavior?"
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=204882946189260&pending {quoted text}
This is a formal and public request of Vita Nuda and AANR to issue a formal apology to YNA and its members.
Vita Nuda’s (the under-35 division of AANR) group members have taken it on themselves to harass our members. So we would like to start by saying we are truly sorry for any embarrassment they might have caused. Unfortunately there are people in the world who truly believe that anyone who does not agree with them is not only ...wrong but is causing some personal damage to them and their group. So for all of you out there who have no idea what I am talking about, this is what happened. We were contacted by a member of VN last weekend - he sent us an angry email of accusations and demanded to get personal information about ourselves and our group. It goes without saying that we cordially declined - it is simply none of his business. Then him and another member (at least 1) decided to post on our facebook page that we like pages which we should not. After which they decided to friend some of our members so they could see their profile pictures and see what they like and what they say - needless to say that we do not condone such behavior and consider such an act to be a vulgar display and horrible way of invading someone’s trust and privacy. They probably think of themselves as righteous but in reality they are simply being intrusive, belligerent, offensive and down right rude. They feel the need to police our group even though they really have no right to. While we always think that the debate is healthy - what they are doing is not considered a debate. It is simply slander, since they are just taking a “holier than though” attitude and are only interested in voicing their opinion. If they really cared they would not have been posting their issues publicly - they would have contacted us directly and expressed their concerns in a calm and professional manner. So now that they have made their point we ask that they (the people who caused all this drama, the VN organisation that they represent and AANR who is the parent organization) issue a formal apology to our members in general, the individual people they felt compelled to attack, and to YNA as a whole. We ask that they refrain from such behavior in the future. If they are so unhappy with the way we do things then they should simply leave our group - that would be the right thing to do. We do not need nor do we want people who feel it is their duty to judge - the naturist movement has enough issues as is without close-minded members getting in our way.
Obviously invites were sent to just about anyone related or not but it was impossible to tell as the guest list was hidden. Some folks said they had no Idea what was going on nor cared. Naturally those with the knowledge of th situation spelled out just who and what Vita Nuda was and that they did not speak for annr or any other group or organization and neither was it the other way around. Even Tom Mulhill aanr PR rep had to try to clarify things. It was explained that no one organization was attacking another. Things continued to heat up throughout the weekend as the YNA page owner insisted that there was an assault on there purposed morality and that of their members, eventually shifting focus to Robbe.
{one of Robbe's comments}
young naturists america is obviously run by a guy behind a computer screen who cares nothing about nudist/naturist values and is exploiting naturism by using the words exhibitionism, voyeurism, swinging etc on the YNA page. T...his
1. draws the wrong type of people
2. turns away true naturists
Sure, a naturist or nudist can be a swinger, but using the word naturist as a tool to attract swingers as if nudity=sex is EXACTLY OPPOSITE of true naturist values.
{Young Naturist Americas comment}
Hey Robbe - Could you at least say you are sorry for putting those girls through that? I truly think that would be the right thing to do... simply email them (not even in public - just as long as they know you did not mean to hurt them and that you really were trying to do a good thing)... how is that? fair?
{Random comment}
14?.....no, not her...not even aware of that one. One of our friends and i was talking and she asked me if ____ was a swinger and i told her..not that I was aware of, she is into that lifestyle and has met several nudist who are ALSO swingers, so she was just wondering. Since she is more into a sexual direction of nudism, she didn't want to upset the group so she told him she didnt want to join VNW cuz shes afraid that it might be a conflict with some of the group. ____ will know who Im talking about but Im not putting her name out there cuz I respect her too much. But I can guarantee,,He didn't ask anything that was inappropriate. We ask for pics and info also..as do EVERY legitimate nudist group that is interested in the safety of their group members
{Sam Miller's comment}
In the early 2000's there was a movement within the nudist community that never took off, called "progressive nudism", a movement that believes deregulating the sexual conservatism of nudism is the only way to truly be FREE and therefore ac...hieve an ideal perfection.
"Traditional Nudism" vs. "Progressive Nudism"
So in about 5 years progressive nudism went from being a perceived threat to being nothing at all, it's hard to even Google it. Traditional nudism has been and will continue to be the favored form of nudism in America. There will always be somebody who thinks they are some kind of open-minded freedom seeker by accepting everything.....but predictably they are either a male with the mind of a fledgeling or a female with an awfully fake looking profile (aka, a male).
VN, FYN, VNW, VNA, AANR, TNS are all TRADITIONAL nudist entities. If YNA wants to be some kind of new evolution of thought and freedom, I can tell you I've been around this block long enough to see that movement burn out very quickly. So I'm not threatened by whatever blend the YNA webmaster thinks they are creating. I'm just disappointed that all that hard work will become nothing, when it could have been...and maybe still could be....so much more.
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The textual battle became even more venomous as the weekend wore on. I would have posted some more of the YNA page owners comments but I see that they have been deleted with the exception of Robbe's. Then again the early comments made by swinger girl, Ginie Lopez begging not to be unfriended because she meets so many swingers from the page was also removed by them it seems.
I think everyone was tired of all of the whole fiasco and posted apologies. Wearily folks meant to go on with the rest of their lives since the YNA page owner insisted on a public atonement.
{Robbe's apology for any offense}
Public Statement regarding YNA (Young Naturists America)
Friends,
I am the Founder of Florida Young Naturists. I apologize if I have offended anyone. I work closely with VitaNuda and we share many similar views on things, including the fact that naturist/nudist web information for young adults should not be sex-driven. I feel that the type of information promoted on the YNA Facebook page may give young adults the idea that free sex is somehow a basic part of naturism/nudism and this simply is not true. I also believe that linking a young naturists page to sex-driven pages will give adults who prey on younger adults the idea that young naturists as a whole are interested in these types of things. When a group calls themselves Young Naturists America, to some this may represent how all young naturists in America think. I for one strongly disagree and the last thing I want is for some self-proclaimed, proud voyeurs, exhibitionists and swingers to show up at the events I plan.
The moderator of the YNA page obviously feels different and in agreeing to disagree the moderator has spoken for YNA as whole, thus making it necessary for me to publicly say that I do no support YNA. I will not create an event to say this or send out a mass email to say this, but I will say this to anyone who asks me about YNA. From what I can gather YNA is a lifestyle group or at least the person behind the FB page wants it to be a lifestyle group, perhaps to attract more people. I personally feel that it is a slap in the face to the image of young naturists who have worked hard for years to gain a reputation of respect and wholesomeness and I will continue to work hard to protect our reputation.
Vita Nuda, FYN, myself personally- we do not ban swingers from coming to our events or becoming members, people's sex lives are none of our business, but we don't advertise swinging and sex in order to gain members and attract people to our movement and we don't condone such behavior or purposely try to attract these types of people.
In my defense, though I apologize if I hurt anyones feelings, I simply pointed out that the YNA page was linked to voyeur, exhibition and swinger pages through it's "likes and interests" in hopes that this was a mistake and YNA would remove them. This was after several failed attempts by myself and others connected with VN, AANR and other groups that could not get in touch with anyone at YNA to ask questions. When I brought up these sexual links I was called closed-minded and the moderator of the page became argumentative.I have removed YNA from my friends and do not wish to support a "young naturists" group with those types of "activities and interests" listed, period.
Robbe White
Founder, Florida Young Naturists
The Florida Young Naturists are non-profit Special Interest Group located within the Naturist Society. FYN does not speak directly for TNS, VN or AANR, though all are important to our growth and the success of positive, wholesome nude recreation among young adults. I will do my best to uphold the young naturists movement with dignity and respect for all, without compromising my personal beliefs that social nudism is in of itself pure, natural and not vile or deviant.
3/3/2011
Everyone associated with the event continued to post comments until the event date effectively ended and there were plenty of remarks from people that such a public scuffle looked bad for the whole of naturism. It was also reminded that this tryst began because of a rogue private communication and YNA had made it a public issue. There was also an immediate concern that some things were being swept under the rug.
Now YNA has splattered their blogs and web pages including nudistnaturistamerica.org with the headline "Robbe White of Florida Young Naturists Attacks YNA - Again!" sitting Robbes original public apology statement as the nature of the new grievance. (Robbes statement above)
{Response from YNA on the nudistnaturistamerica.org forum}
After much thought I have come to the realization that responding to such ludicrous and unfounded accusations by some random guy will prove to be harmful for the cause - for our cause - of mainstream acceptance for safe nudist / naturist values and this way of life (with no sexual agendas). We as a collective should stand for acceptance and the ability to not judge people based on their looks or "social stature" but on the merits of who they truly are in the core of their souls. Accepting or not accepting someone because he / she might have tattoos, piercings or is in the midst of a sex change operation are not all that different than rejecting people for being overweight / underweight, part of a certain religious sect or even skin color... at the end of the day we are who we are - for better or worse and we are not so different from anyone else. Stop pointing fingers, starting wars, jumping up and down yelling me me me!!! It is not about the ME.... Its is about us and getting people to see past the superficial and dive straight into our hearts. We are not about dues but about values! And the ability to try and accept other peoples points of view without tolerating any illegal activities or inappropriate behavior. Respect your boundaries, pick your battles, never intrude on someones privacy or personal comfort zone and / or personal space. Any comments, concerns and issues are to be reported immediately to the powers at be without making them public unless it is serious enough to immediately call the authorities. If each one of us could simply dig down and think of the greater good rather than the personal gain then we could accomplish great things together!
So with that I here by throw away all the negativity that has been festering around us and call a truce! I really hope we can all turn over a new leaf and start fresh...
Our next event will be to celebrate life, love, happiness, sunny days and great big smiles
Allot of voices have come to bat for Robbe and point out that he's not just some random guy he is an integral part of where the young naturist movement, has, piercing, tattoos, has friends from all walks of life and is very passionate obviously. Thankfully it looks as though some sort of truce has been made and the mudslinging has ended since there is still an interest in working together in the future and this can be put in the past so we can plan better events with combined fervor.
Personally I would think it would be a great opportunity to have a face to face pow wow or a peaceful conversation in the hot tub with the YNA folks. Its possible we may find all this crap to be a breakdown in communication and a big misunderstanding.
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